We lived in Tower Hamlets for a number of years when I worked in Canary Wharf. We had an apartment on Narrow Street and that area was almost totally white. 100 yards away was almost totally Bangladeshi and Pakistani. There was no mixing. Nobody spoke to each other. We could have been in separate countries. We left to return to the Welsh countryside around 10 years ago and are now seeing African and Asian families placed here by Rayner’s project scatter. Hopefully this time there’ll be better integration but the future doesn’t look great.
In fairness, why would they integrate with a culture that will be numerically overwhelmed in a matter of decades. Also, if the objective is retaining parts of England as England, how does Asians integrating with Africans help - setting aside that they won’t.
But one can’t help wondering, why its new inhabitants left their homelands in the first place - if they’re only going to establish the same enclaves they left behind? - Frank Haviland
I wondered the same exact thing when I was living in Queens, NY where both my paternal grandparents and maternal great-grandparents settled. The part of Queens where my husband and I stayed was originally an Italian neighborhood with Irish, Russians and Dominicans. There was even a synagogue. Overnight, this diverse NY neighborhood became oversaturated with Bangladeshi multi-generational families. I am convinced that the "family" who lived next door to us was an older man with four wives with a wide range of ages. Money seemed to flow into the neighborhood, the mosque went up, and the popular Dominican restaurant down the street from the mosque, mysteriously closed. People who were not bought out by the new money flowing in, flew American flags every day of the year, because they were under siege.
I feel incredibly sorry for the people unable to move when the government enforces 'diversity' on them in this way. They can do nothing about it, and when they object they're invariably jailed for 'hate crimes'.
About 35 years ago I was a Trainee Teacher, Primary and we were taught to teach children to think outside the box and question everything, but sometime over the past 20 years or so, that teaching has changed and now all kids and the adults they became, can't think outside the box and only do what they are told and without question, like little Robots, in preparation, presumably for this, which happened after 2019 and now the adults they have become, have no fight in them, but only a mute acceptance of events as they occur and nothing stirs them up anymore, or at least, so it seems to me. Teaching is the one job I found I could not do, of all of the jobs I did, in my working lifetime - it takes a special sort of person to do that sort of Teaching work and that person was not me.
Frank, you have quoted some statistics here without reference to any hard data. I'm just wondering who commissioned the survey(s) you refer to, date, sample size etc. Are you able to provide that information please?
C4 survey and documentary reveals What British Muslims Really Think
Category: News Release
Back to news
11 April 2016
Channel 4 has commissioned an extensive and rigorous survey to get a better understanding of British Muslims’ attitudes to living in Britain and British institutions, social issues including gender equality, homosexuality and issues relating to freedom of expression and the degree of sympathy for the use of violence and terrorist acts. The results are explored in a special current affairs documentary, presented by Trevor Phillips: What British Muslims Really Think – 10pm, Wednesday 13th April.
Europe is on heightened terror alert following the attacks in Paris and Brussels and the security services raising the threat posed by hundreds of home-grown jihadists. Politicians and Muslim leaders claim that the values of these extremists are shared only by a tiny minority in the UK. Channel 4 commissioned the survey to get the views from British Muslims themselves rather than those who claim to speak on their behalf; and, in particular to try to understand why some young Muslims are being drawn to violence.
Unlike many other surveys of Muslim opinion, which have predominantly been done by phone or online, ICM used face-to-face, in-home research to question a representative sample of 1,000 Muslims across Great Britain. ICM also used a “control sample” to compare what British Muslims thought with the rest of the British population.
At the top-line level, the survey suggests that a mainstream British Muslim majority have similar values and attitudes to the wider British public on issues such as support for British institutions and a feeling of belonging to Britain.
But looking deeper into the results, a chasm develops between those Muslims surveyed and the wider population on attitudes to liberal values on issues such as gender equality, homosexuality and issues relating to freedom of expression. And it also reveals significant differences on attitudes to violence and terrorism.
The survey’s findings include:
34% would inform the police if they thought somebody they knew was getting involved with people who support terrorism in Syria
Q: If you thought that someone who is close to you was getting involved with people who support terrorism in Syria, would you report it to the police?
4% sympathise with people who take part in suicide bombings
Q: Please tell me tell me whether you sympathise or condemn people who take part in suicide bombing to fight injustice
Net sympathise: 4% (completely sympathise: 1%, sympathise to some extent: 3%)
4% sympathise with people who commit terrorist actions as a form of political protest.
Q: To what extent do you sympathise or condemn with people who commit terrorist acts as a form of political protest?
Net sympathise: 4% (completely sympathise: 0.5: sympathise to some extent: 3.5%)
52% do not believe that homosexuality should be legal in Britain
Q: To what extent you agree or disagree with each one: homosexuality should be legal in Britain?
Net agree 18% (strongly agree 8%, tend to agree 10%)
Net disagree: 52% (strongly disagree: 38%, tend to disagree: 14%)
47% do not believe that it is acceptable for a school teacher to be homosexual
Q: To what extent do you agree or disagree that it is acceptable for a homosexual person to be a teacher in a school?
Net disagree: 47% (strongly disagree: 35%, tend to disagree: 12%)
23% support the introduction of Sharia Law.
Q: To what extent, if at all, would you support or oppose there being areas of Britain in which Sharia law is introduced instead of British law?
Net support: 23% (strongly support: 7%, tend to support: 17%)
32% refuse to condemn those who take part in violence against those who mock the Prophet
Q: Please tell me whether you sympathise or condemn people who take part in violence against those who mock the Prophet
Net sympathise: 18% (completely sympathise: 9%, sympathise to some extent: 9%, neither symathise or condemn: 14%)
39% agree that “wives should always obey their husbands”.
Q: To what extent you agree or disagree that wives should always obey their husbands?
Net agree: 39% (strongly agree: 15%, tend to agree: 24%)
66% completely condemn those people who take part in stoning those who commit adultery.
Q: Please tell me whether you sympathise or condemn people who take part in stoning those who commit adultery.
Net condemn: 79%. (completely condemn: 66%, condemn to some extent: 13%)
Net sympathise: 5% (completely sympathise: 2%, tend to sympathise: 3%)
31% think it's acceptable for a man to have more than one wife
Q: To what extent you agree or disagree [that] it is acceptable for a British Muslim to keep more than one wife?
Net agree: 31% (strongly agree: 14%, tend to agree: 16%)
More positive findings include:
• A large majority of British Muslims feel a strong sense of belonging to their local area (91%). This is higher than the national average (76%)
• A large majority of British Muslims feel a strong sense of belonging to Britain (86%). This is higher than the national average (83%)
• A large majority of British Muslims feel that they are able to practice their religion freely in Britain (94%)
• British Muslims are more likely than the rest of the population to feel that they can influence decisions affecting Britain (33% vs 21%)
• British Muslims are more likely than the rest of the population to feel that their local MP reflects their views (44% vs 41%)
• 88% of British Muslims think that Britain is a good place for Muslims to live
• 78% of British Muslims would like to integrate into British life on most things apart from Islamic schooling and some laws
Channel 4 invited writer and former Chair of the Equality and Human Rights Commission Trevor Phillips to analyse and interpret the survey for the documentary. Phillips argues its findings pose profound questions for our society and the implications for future relations between Britain’s Muslim and non-Muslim communities.
Trevor Phillips says: “Hearing what British Muslims themselves think, rather than listening to those purporting to speak on their behalf, is critical if we are to prevent the establishment of a nation within our nation. Many of the results will be troubling to Muslims and non-Muslims alike – and the analysis of the age profile shows us that the social attitudes revealed are unlikely to change quickly.
“The integration of Britain’s Muslims will probably be the hardest task we’ve ever faced. It will require the abandonment of the milk-and-water multiculturalism still so beloved of many, and the adoption of a far more muscular approach to integration.”
A juggler. FFS? And you expect others to put up a fight. Do you even have children yourself on circus skillz pay? ,had one confused suicide case to an estranged sucker mother, impressed by your Mills Mess.
This is why they left. Hejira . Serious people. And you’re a pushover. Got a real job yet?
clowns won’t put up any resistance. To anything . Because having successful children to fill those classes is resistance .: not living a silly clowning western life paid for by others.
After ther war, there won't be any [white people]/[Muslims] left in the UK. Pick your winner.
My view is that if the war kicks off within the next 15 years, my money is on the Anglo Saxons. Within 15-25 years, anybody's guess. After 25 years, the Muslims will win.
We lived in Tower Hamlets for a number of years when I worked in Canary Wharf. We had an apartment on Narrow Street and that area was almost totally white. 100 yards away was almost totally Bangladeshi and Pakistani. There was no mixing. Nobody spoke to each other. We could have been in separate countries. We left to return to the Welsh countryside around 10 years ago and are now seeing African and Asian families placed here by Rayner’s project scatter. Hopefully this time there’ll be better integration but the future doesn’t look great.
In fairness, why would they integrate with a culture that will be numerically overwhelmed in a matter of decades. Also, if the objective is retaining parts of England as England, how does Asians integrating with Africans help - setting aside that they won’t.
Drive them off.
England No More:
But one can’t help wondering, why its new inhabitants left their homelands in the first place - if they’re only going to establish the same enclaves they left behind? - Frank Haviland
I wondered the same exact thing when I was living in Queens, NY where both my paternal grandparents and maternal great-grandparents settled. The part of Queens where my husband and I stayed was originally an Italian neighborhood with Irish, Russians and Dominicans. There was even a synagogue. Overnight, this diverse NY neighborhood became oversaturated with Bangladeshi multi-generational families. I am convinced that the "family" who lived next door to us was an older man with four wives with a wide range of ages. Money seemed to flow into the neighborhood, the mosque went up, and the popular Dominican restaurant down the street from the mosque, mysteriously closed. People who were not bought out by the new money flowing in, flew American flags every day of the year, because they were under siege.
I feel incredibly sorry for the people unable to move when the government enforces 'diversity' on them in this way. They can do nothing about it, and when they object they're invariably jailed for 'hate crimes'.
About 35 years ago I was a Trainee Teacher, Primary and we were taught to teach children to think outside the box and question everything, but sometime over the past 20 years or so, that teaching has changed and now all kids and the adults they became, can't think outside the box and only do what they are told and without question, like little Robots, in preparation, presumably for this, which happened after 2019 and now the adults they have become, have no fight in them, but only a mute acceptance of events as they occur and nothing stirs them up anymore, or at least, so it seems to me. Teaching is the one job I found I could not do, of all of the jobs I did, in my working lifetime - it takes a special sort of person to do that sort of Teaching work and that person was not me.
Again, Frank's writing gets straight to the point, crystal clear.
Thank you!
Frank, you have quoted some statistics here without reference to any hard data. I'm just wondering who commissioned the survey(s) you refer to, date, sample size etc. Are you able to provide that information please?
Certainly. Two sources:
Channel 4 program 'What British Muslims Really Think' https://www.channel4.com/press/news/c4-survey-and-documentary-reveals-what-british-muslims-really-think
Henry Jackson Society survey https://henryjacksonsociety.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/HJS-Deck-200324-Final.pdf
The Henry Jackson survey is attached. Unfortunately the link to Channel 4 appears to be broken.
Works for me,
C4 survey and documentary reveals What British Muslims Really Think
Category: News Release
Back to news
11 April 2016
Channel 4 has commissioned an extensive and rigorous survey to get a better understanding of British Muslims’ attitudes to living in Britain and British institutions, social issues including gender equality, homosexuality and issues relating to freedom of expression and the degree of sympathy for the use of violence and terrorist acts. The results are explored in a special current affairs documentary, presented by Trevor Phillips: What British Muslims Really Think – 10pm, Wednesday 13th April.
Europe is on heightened terror alert following the attacks in Paris and Brussels and the security services raising the threat posed by hundreds of home-grown jihadists. Politicians and Muslim leaders claim that the values of these extremists are shared only by a tiny minority in the UK. Channel 4 commissioned the survey to get the views from British Muslims themselves rather than those who claim to speak on their behalf; and, in particular to try to understand why some young Muslims are being drawn to violence.
Unlike many other surveys of Muslim opinion, which have predominantly been done by phone or online, ICM used face-to-face, in-home research to question a representative sample of 1,000 Muslims across Great Britain. ICM also used a “control sample” to compare what British Muslims thought with the rest of the British population.
At the top-line level, the survey suggests that a mainstream British Muslim majority have similar values and attitudes to the wider British public on issues such as support for British institutions and a feeling of belonging to Britain.
But looking deeper into the results, a chasm develops between those Muslims surveyed and the wider population on attitudes to liberal values on issues such as gender equality, homosexuality and issues relating to freedom of expression. And it also reveals significant differences on attitudes to violence and terrorism.
The survey’s findings include:
34% would inform the police if they thought somebody they knew was getting involved with people who support terrorism in Syria
Q: If you thought that someone who is close to you was getting involved with people who support terrorism in Syria, would you report it to the police?
4% sympathise with people who take part in suicide bombings
Q: Please tell me tell me whether you sympathise or condemn people who take part in suicide bombing to fight injustice
Net sympathise: 4% (completely sympathise: 1%, sympathise to some extent: 3%)
4% sympathise with people who commit terrorist actions as a form of political protest.
Q: To what extent do you sympathise or condemn with people who commit terrorist acts as a form of political protest?
Net sympathise: 4% (completely sympathise: 0.5: sympathise to some extent: 3.5%)
52% do not believe that homosexuality should be legal in Britain
Q: To what extent you agree or disagree with each one: homosexuality should be legal in Britain?
Net agree 18% (strongly agree 8%, tend to agree 10%)
Net disagree: 52% (strongly disagree: 38%, tend to disagree: 14%)
47% do not believe that it is acceptable for a school teacher to be homosexual
Q: To what extent do you agree or disagree that it is acceptable for a homosexual person to be a teacher in a school?
Net disagree: 47% (strongly disagree: 35%, tend to disagree: 12%)
23% support the introduction of Sharia Law.
Q: To what extent, if at all, would you support or oppose there being areas of Britain in which Sharia law is introduced instead of British law?
Net support: 23% (strongly support: 7%, tend to support: 17%)
32% refuse to condemn those who take part in violence against those who mock the Prophet
Q: Please tell me whether you sympathise or condemn people who take part in violence against those who mock the Prophet
Net sympathise: 18% (completely sympathise: 9%, sympathise to some extent: 9%, neither symathise or condemn: 14%)
39% agree that “wives should always obey their husbands”.
Q: To what extent you agree or disagree that wives should always obey their husbands?
Net agree: 39% (strongly agree: 15%, tend to agree: 24%)
66% completely condemn those people who take part in stoning those who commit adultery.
Q: Please tell me whether you sympathise or condemn people who take part in stoning those who commit adultery.
Net condemn: 79%. (completely condemn: 66%, condemn to some extent: 13%)
Net sympathise: 5% (completely sympathise: 2%, tend to sympathise: 3%)
31% think it's acceptable for a man to have more than one wife
Q: To what extent you agree or disagree [that] it is acceptable for a British Muslim to keep more than one wife?
Net agree: 31% (strongly agree: 14%, tend to agree: 16%)
More positive findings include:
• A large majority of British Muslims feel a strong sense of belonging to their local area (91%). This is higher than the national average (76%)
• A large majority of British Muslims feel a strong sense of belonging to Britain (86%). This is higher than the national average (83%)
• A large majority of British Muslims feel that they are able to practice their religion freely in Britain (94%)
• British Muslims are more likely than the rest of the population to feel that they can influence decisions affecting Britain (33% vs 21%)
• British Muslims are more likely than the rest of the population to feel that their local MP reflects their views (44% vs 41%)
• 88% of British Muslims think that Britain is a good place for Muslims to live
• 78% of British Muslims would like to integrate into British life on most things apart from Islamic schooling and some laws
Channel 4 invited writer and former Chair of the Equality and Human Rights Commission Trevor Phillips to analyse and interpret the survey for the documentary. Phillips argues its findings pose profound questions for our society and the implications for future relations between Britain’s Muslim and non-Muslim communities.
Trevor Phillips says: “Hearing what British Muslims themselves think, rather than listening to those purporting to speak on their behalf, is critical if we are to prevent the establishment of a nation within our nation. Many of the results will be troubling to Muslims and non-Muslims alike – and the analysis of the age profile shows us that the social attitudes revealed are unlikely to change quickly.
“The integration of Britain’s Muslims will probably be the hardest task we’ve ever faced. It will require the abandonment of the milk-and-water multiculturalism still so beloved of many, and the adoption of a far more muscular approach to integration.”
The only blanket statement about diversity which holds water is that it is the primary component of strife.
Appreciate author is being e en handed but given the set terms of loss of Englishness not clear how this can be a success
Perhaps the end of Whites in the East End will be a success, time will tell.
A juggler. FFS? And you expect others to put up a fight. Do you even have children yourself on circus skillz pay? ,had one confused suicide case to an estranged sucker mother, impressed by your Mills Mess.
This is why they left. Hejira . Serious people. And you’re a pushover. Got a real job yet?
clowns won’t put up any resistance. To anything . Because having successful children to fill those classes is resistance .: not living a silly clowning western life paid for by others.
Diversity + Proximity = War.
It's an equation as old as humanity.
After ther war, there won't be any [white people]/[Muslims] left in the UK. Pick your winner.
My view is that if the war kicks off within the next 15 years, my money is on the Anglo Saxons. Within 15-25 years, anybody's guess. After 25 years, the Muslims will win.